this is an interview with a professor of biblical studies at a college in north carolina discussing the ultimate question of, "if God all loving and all knowing why is there still suffering in the world?"
i would be curious to hear your response to either the interview or the question.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=19096131
thanks.
5 comments:
To get things started, this may be a little too simplistic but, I don't understand what's so bad about suffering. I know that word brings up plenty of images of pain and injustice, but I don't believe that God is afraid of us getting hurt.
There, I said it. I've never understood why can't God exist if we feel pain? Sometimes out of great hurt comes the most loving reactions. Or what if someone I love dearly dies and I feel nothing. It doesn't hurt, though they were my favorite person on this whole planet. Now that's sad. That pain I should feel would be from years of time spent with them (good and bad).
If we live our lives with no pain, I don't believe we can truly appreciate life. We'd be numb and unable to understand completely His love for us let alone anything else. I believe love needs to contrast against something, don't you? Can love still be love if there is nothing to compare it to? Maybe. Maybe not.
Would Jesus' death for my sins be any different if instead of being crucified, He died of natural causes? Did He need to suffer?
Tag, your it.
Great link Sam! I really appreciate Bart Ehrman's thoughts and honesty. Misquoting Jesus was a pretty controversial book and I am sure that his new one will be a hot topic.
I think that Ehrman is on to something when he talks about his faith journey and how it led him to where he is now. I don't think people change their faith because the evidence demands it, I think they change because their faith isn't "working" for them any more. People believe based on emotion and then justify their beliefs rationally.
Contrary to Ehrman, I am a Christian in part because of the problem of evil/suffering. I have studied it a lot, and I haven't seen any logical contradiction with the Christian faith. When most people ask the question, "Why does God allow suffering in the world?" I think they really mean, "Why does God allow the suffering in my life?" People want to know why a good God would allow them to hurt.
To me, evil reminds me that the world is not as it should be. If there is no God, pain is not a problem and it shouldn't bother us. But when I look at the evil in the world (and in my life), I have to conclude, "Surely their is more to life than this. Surely life isn't just about meaningless suffering." Christianity teaches that, indeed, suffering is not part of the way the world was meant to be. One day, God is going to put an end to pain and evil.
Thanks for the great link! Keep 'em coming!
Matt Edwards
thanks for your responses guys, it has given much to think about in my "free time"... what i have of it. (matt you know what i'm talking about)
if i may, i would like to use the cliche of the "glass being half empty or half full". it seems erhman has the "half empty" view on life and seems to focus on the pain and suffering in the world and ask why, which is important (hence the brett dennen song i posted...) but i think it is more important to focus on the positives and ask the question:
what are we doing about the negatives? what if God allows things to happen in order to give people a chance to respond? jen, i like that you said, "what's so bad about suffering?" doesn't suffering allow us to know what is good in the world?
why are we so quick to look at God when a "natural disaster" happens or when someone dies... aren't these natural things?
it would be better to sit down to a cup of coffee or a pint of beer with mr. ehrman in order to get his true spirit on this matter... so i am basing my thoughts based on his interview.
thanks guys
Though this is unrelated to your post, just thought I'd let you know I am putting you on my friend's list on my blog.
--Stu Fullerton
(deckofficer.blogspot.com)
You guys might have a point! I want to suggest a few more thoughts to add to the bundle.
I'm not sure Ehrman is right in his thinking. Not to say that he doesn't bring some good ideas to the table, he definitely has taken an honest look at this problem of evil. The question to me is, if God isn't doing anything for the people of this world, then what was the life of Jesus about? Not to say that with Jesus comes a clean and safe life for everyone since his work on this world, but that Jesus has brought redemption through his life and to our suffering.
Yes the bible has many explanations for the reason of suffering and pain. But who says it needs to be just one of those things. I believe it is contextual for each situation. No it is not fare to say that 'in all suffering comes redemption' but that is only because there is mystery. The problem with the idea of mystery isn't that it's an excuse for something metaphysically non-existent. But that we are human. We are finite beings with finite minds, that can only reason things out to a certain extent. Like Blaise Pascal once said, 'reason knows its limits'. Faith isn't a step in life where we are assured of everything in reality and of a God that is loving and powerful and yet for some unthinkable reason doesn't prevent starvation, even of children in Africa... or anywhere else. There may be no rational reason for it. In the first chapter of Mark there is a story of a man with leprosy and in verse 41 it says that Jesus was moved with 'compassion'. From the greek it would be better translated into 'anger', now why would Jesus be moved to anger at the meeting of a leper? There might be a few reasons, but i believe it is because he was angry not at the leper but at the situation that would allow for this disease to maim this man and ostracize him from his people. The thing is, is that God does care. God does love, and God doesn't like it when these things happen. But what did Jesus do? He healed the leper. He took the action that would help the situation. So lets get a little existential for a moment. Yes God allows shit to happen in this world... for some reason. Jesus said, 'the poor will always be with you'. But we can't resort to a similar response, in thinking about suffering, that many have to the problem of poverty. Many read the words of Jesus and think, 'OH, the poor will always be here... well i guess i can't make a difference'. Indifference is the opposite of love, and God called us to love. Maybe God's actions in this world and his love is demonstrated in our actions to love the world. We must live a life of love and try to do everything possible to love those in suffering. God, throughout scripture, uses people to do his will, so who says he isn't working today? Maybe, we're just to lazy to act. Maybe we have made everything so safe and rational that even the thought of stepping out in action against suffering has been completely lost.
So, there are some natural disasters and yes those are horrible, and maybe we can do something about it, and maybe not. Either way it is a testament to the shape of the world, and the world is not an easy world.
The thing about faith, is that it is hard. Jesus didn't call us to a life of faith that feeds our own desires. Jesus called us to die, to pick up our cross and follow him. But in following him, carrying our crosses, we can't suppose that we are alone. For if we were following blindly, then we would be alone. Jesus is with us in our suffering, and along with us on our life's journey. But this isn't to say that we follow with eyes and mouth closed. We should talk to God about it, we should wrestle with it. In the Old Testament, there was a character... the brother of Esau , Jacob. Jacob, later in his life, on the road is met by God himself and he wrestles with him. And after God performs a very dangerous wrestling move, ask a wrestler and they can probably give you the actual term for the move, Jacob is renamed. From Jacob, meaning 'heel grabber' to Israel meaning 'one who wrestles with God'. Interesting that from Israel the whole nation of Israel is raised. I believe that the name of Israel is essential to one's faith. If we are bound by God's covenant as a people to him and through Jesus redeemed by him, than to have a relationship involves wrestling. We shouldn't remain stoic and quiet. To have faith and a relationship with God sometimes means that you have to go head to head against God himself.
So, yes there is shit in this world, and yet though it seems like God doesn't know what the hell he's doing on it doesn't mean that he doing nothing, or that he doesn't even exist at all. That's just a copout for not wrestling with the state of things. Either way, Christian or not, we as a people on this world have a lot of work to do. And don't mistake it to be easy or safe... it's not. It's dirty and it sucks. Suffering sucks.
Post a Comment